Pro-Gun Activist on Murder-Suicide: "He killed his children out of love."

On the fourth of July this year, a gruesome murder-suicide took place in Dundee, Oregon. That afternoon, Randall Engels, 37, shot and killed his estranged wife Amy Engels, 35; their daughter Bailey, 13; and son Jackson, 11. Amy Engels had filed for divorce just weeks earlier on May 29, 2012, citing an "immediate danger" to her children. "My husband has threatened to steal them and not return them," she told a Yamhill County judge. "He has threatened to hurt them. He yells at them and makes them feel nervous and upset."

The Dundee community was shocked and saddened by the unspeakable tragedy, but one Oregon pro-gun activist saw the murders as evidence that Randall Engels "loved" his family.

"FancyJack," a prolific pro-gun commenter at the KVAL.com website, had plenty to say about the murder-suicide. When gun violence prevention blogger "Baldr Odinson" responded to an article about the incident by writing, "It's not the gun I oppose, it's the ease of which people like Mr. Engels are able to get them and use them," "FancyJack" was outraged and replied:

You squeeze a trigger, a nice steady pull, so as not to interfere with the aim, everyone is dead so his use of the firearm was proficient ... He did not flip out, he was methodical with the destruction of his family, again everyone is dead. Suicide is a tool, just like a firearm, it has its place in humanity, that you fear it as you fear firearms is not surprising. Once he made the decision, he would have been at peace, he took his family with him, he loved them and could not leave them to the mercies of the type people who exploit the dead to pursue a liberal social agenda, I'd bet Mr. Engels would have echoed my sentiment that he was protecting his family from people, people who think like you.

When another commenter facetiously pressed "FancyJack" to indicate whether it would be OK for parents to seek out an abortion to protect a child from the "liberal social agenda," "FancyJack" replied:

Yes, provided that we killed the mother when we killed the baby as she would not be here to protect the child. He killed his children out of love, liberal women kill their children out of selfishness, if abortion was fair, we would kill them both, but as we both know, abortion is a liberal social agenda whose intent was to clean up the gene pool, from my perspective, killing a mother that would kill her child is a just act and protects the family.

"FancyJack" also recently found time to leave his thoughts on the shooting deaths of young black men at the KVAL website. "Live by the hoody, die by the hoody," he wrote.

Pro-Gun Activist Calls Murder of Trayvon Martin "Population Control"

We have already published several blogs here at "Things Pro-Gun Activists Say" cataloging the disturbing comments that pro-gunners have made about Trayvon Martin since the 17-year-old was gunned down by concealed handgun permit holder George Zimmerman on February 26, 2012. Sadly, more than a month after the murder of this young man, pro-gun activists continue to direct these angry and offensive comments at the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence (CSGV).

One of the pro-gun blogs we heard from is "Guns for Everyone." They made their feelings patently clear to us on Twitter, stating, "#zimmerman = population control...... #dealwithit." Guns For Everyone was created by pro-gun activist Joshua Chase of Atlanta, Georgia.

That was just the warm-up, however. They later directed another Tweet at CSGV and former Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence president Paul Helmke from Oklahoma pro-gun activist Dustin "guns get shit done" Gerhart, where Gerhart bragged about buying a gun through a private sale in a parking lot. Private sellers are not required to conduct background checks nor maintain records of sale under Oklahoma law—these transactions are totally unregulated by government and law enforcement. "whatchu think bout that nigga!" Guns for Everyone asked us.

Then there was pro-gunner Donald David Dalby III, who posted the following "joke" on the CSGV Facebook page: "I was going to kill some defenseless children. since, despite the 2nd amendment, guns are bad, what should I use? I have a 14" machete, a led pipe, and a LugerP08 semi-automatic pistol. I'll be sure to use one of the former two, since guns are bad and all.. suggestions?"

To pro-gun activist "Calvin Raven Eagle" from Atlanta, Georgia, the slaying of an unarmed Trayvon Martin came down to an issue of parenting. "PROSECUTE HIS PARENTS FOR NEGLIGENCE," he wrote on the CSGV Facebook Wall.

Then there was Florida pro-gun activist and conservative businessman "Subnetted," who wanted us to know he was getting drunk and thought Trayvon deserved to die. In the word of his Tweet to us: "Drunk at the bar with sexy girlfriend, life is good. P.S. #OWS are dirty. #Trayon deserved it. What else? @CSGV are retarded. And yes #tcot." Needless to say, for the parents and family of Trayvon Martin, life is anything but good today.

But the most offensive contribution came from a pro-gun activist going by the pseudonynm, "Gi Vemeaclip," who we have discussed on this blog before. He posted a "Trayvon Tribute" video to our Wall that he created under the YouTube account 1BoredKidProductions.It speaks for itself, and is nothing short of disgusting.

Pro-Gun Activists on Trayvon Martin: "Nigs gonna nig."

Two weeks ago, we posted a blog that compiled a series of offensive comments made by pro-gun activists in the wake of the murder of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin by 28-year-old concealed handgun permit holder George Zimmerman in Sanford, Florida. With controversy over the shooting still raging across the nation, pro-gun activists have yet to temper their remarks. Last week, several flocked to the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence's Facebook page to leave a series of racist postings.

Pro-gun activist Eric Preisser of Fort Worth, Texas—the creator of the People Against the Brady Campaign [to Prevent Gun Violence] Facebook page—responded to the shooting of Trayvon Martin by stating, "nigs gona nig."

Preisser was echoed by pro-gunner Alexander Rocha of Oceanside, California, who replied, "damn that so sick, nigs gunna nig I guess." In the next breath, Rocha was telling us we should give more guns to "law abiding civilians" like him so the "criminals will be on an equal playing field."

Patrick Green, was outraged over the reaction to the murder. "Black kids like that get killed everyday," he wrote, "but as soon as one bad apple shoots him it's OMG WE NEED TO GET RID OF ALL FIREARMS OMGEE! to be honest you sound like teenage girls I mean cmon guys its the second amendment if you dont like it dont buy a gun its incredibly easy."

Pro-gun activist Thomas O'Neill found the topic of shootings involving children hilarious and commented, "Did you guys know that there is a new kind of bullet that is actually built with technology that can pin-point the trajectory to people's heads?! 1 to 4 year old specifically!"

McKenzy Mallon had a good laugh, too, writing, "NO! Guns are evil devices made by evil people! If Zimmerman was not allowed to carry an assault machine gun Trayvon would still be ALIVE!"

"FAMAS [a French assault rifle] assault clips killed mah baby jamal," said pro-gun activist James Butterscotch, mocking the loss of African American children to gun violence. On his Facebook profile, Butterscotch lists his high school as "FUCK SCHOOL NIGGA IMA BE A DOPE DEALER."

Then pro-gun activists began to impersonate African-Americans on the CSGV Facebook page. Posting as "Edward J. Bleachwood," one pro-gunner commented, "if it wasnt 4 guns that yung nigga be still alive." Another pro-gun activist(s) posting under another fake identity, Flight-Cpl Izmash Assaultclip, loved it, replying, "Which young nigger? There are alot of young niggers. People only care if guns kill them. If they are stabbed it won't even make a sidebar." On his Facebook page, "Izmash" then wrote, "1 black kid gets shot(Pretty good way to go) = OMG RACISM HORRIBLE WHITE PEOPLE (Hispanic, Actually) ARE HORRIBLE RACISTS THEY ARE ALL BABY KILLERS. (typed more like: dat racist yo. ma nigga got popped cuz he be BLACK, he aint do notin' wrong. )."

Then there is the fake identity created by a pro-gun activist, named "Gi Vemeaclip." The profile's "Favorite Quotation" is "Nigga you gay." The college is listed as Virginia Tech. The high school is listed as Columbine High School. In pro-gun circles, this qualifies as humor.

Writing to the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence, "Gi Vemeaclip" then made up a story about a dead brother, stating, "Hey people. While this tragedy about the 17 year old kid getting shot is horrific, this is our time to fight the gun nut's uppresor. My little brother was shot at a Detriot Pistons game by someone with a criminal record. He purchased these from a gun show. Unlike today's social media it didn't even get mentioned except a mention in a tiny article in the local newspaper. Detriot is like a Zone in that abandonment nuclear powerplant in ukraine. yet michigon allows open carry. Our governments should have the ablility to modify the constitution. Its what our forefathers would have wanted. If the people don't want the second amendment then it should be removed. If they don't want the first, then it should be removed as well. It should be 'for the people.'"

Finally, we end with a comment left by pro-gun activist Rooster Coburn, who lives just south of Sanford in Florida. On a Huffington Post blog about the NRA's "Stand Your Ground" law in that state, "Rooster" wrote, "Africa for the Africans. India for the Indians. Florida for the Floridians!"

Pro-Gun Activist on Kid Shootings: "In all honesty, I really don't care."

Most pro-gun activists will make a real effort to convince you that they really do care about gun violence, while simultaneously insisting that there is absolutely nothing that can be done to prevent it (thereby conveniently absolving themselves of any responsibility to have to do something about it). But recently we met two pro-gunners who just came out and told it like it is!

The conversation in question happened on February 20, 2012 on the Facebook page of the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence. One of our fans had posted a link to a disturbing new blog, "Kid Shootings." The description of the blog is as follows:

Kid Shootings is a collaborative effort brought to you by authors from Ceasefire Oregon Education Foundation, Protect Minnesota, and States United Against Gun Violence. This blog highlights any and all timely cases of minors, ages 17 and under, who are involved in gun crimes or dangerous situations involving guns in the United States, which we can find reports of. Reported cases span the whole range of incidents: homicides and attempted homicides, accidents, suicides, stray bullet reports, defensive, law enforcement, robberies, kidnappings, “near misses,” and other categories. Some kids are shooters (including intentional and accidental), but most are victims.

Pro-gun activist Charles Cornett from Columbus, Texas jumped in first to comment on the blog posting. Cornett's Favorite Quotation as listed on his Facebook page is, "Anything worth shooting is worth shooting twice. Ammo is cheap, life is expensive." So it's no surprise that his thought on the matter was the following:

We lose 5,000 teens alone every year in car accidents, does that mean we should ban cars too?

It was a typical pro-gun feint—bring up the issue of automobile deaths to distract and change the subject; and hope that people don't realize that decades of extensive regulation of both automobiles and our roads have saved countless lives. Contrast this with the firearms industry, which remains the most unregulated industry in America.

Cornett was then challenged by the original poster in the thread, however, who replied:

You make the assumption I wish to ban guns, but I do not. What have you done, Charles, to reduce kid shootings, or teen driving accidents, for that matter?

With Cornett challenged to ante up on his mock concern regarding teen driving accidents, he found support from another pro-gun activist, Daniel Collien of Churchton, Maryland. Collien is a wonderfully candid pro-gunner who lists "Insurrection" as one of his "Activities and Interests" on Facebook. He wrote:

I hope he hasn't done anything. From a completely detached standpoint, there's too many damn people. 7 billion on a planet that can really only sustain 3 billion people. 3000 here or 5000 there, it is no matter.

But Cornett refused to let Collien upstage him in sheer cruelty. He added:

What have I done? Absolutely nothing, why? Because in all honesty, I really don't care.

Lost your child, your own flesh and blood, to senseless gun violence? Don't worry. The planet is overpopulated! And pro-gun activists? Well, they're doing everything they can to help us trim our numbers here in the United States.

Parenting, Pro-Gun Style

The United States is a country in which more than 3,000 children and teens die each year from gunfire. An additional 17,000+ are injured by gunfire every year. Put simply, it's a level of pain and suffering unequaled anywhere else among industrialized democracies. And it's caused by by the weakest gun laws in the civilized world.

Few things are sacred among pro-gun activists, however, and even this subject is a source of levity and entertainment for them. Furthermore, they will always be the first to tell you that kids and guns are a great mix, despite abundant evidence to the contrary. This blog focuses on four recent stories that provide a disturbing look at American gun culture and how it affects the young.

First, we recently received some new YouTube comments from gun violence prevention activist Abby Spangler. Many of you will remember Abby as the Virginia mom who has received a litany of misogynist, threatening comments from pro-gun activists. Turns out that Abby has a new fan on YouTube who is very proud of his gun collection.

That individual is a 14-year-old who goes by the screen name of "Shedneom," and here is what he had to say to Abby:

Im 14 and have a full automatic m16 and ak47, a tank, a semi a rocket launcher, a silencer for all of the above, a .50 caliber assualt sniper rifle thats anti tank, 10,000 explosive burning deadly rounds.three .50 caliber pistols, a fully automatic 12 guage shotgun. and all my guns use highcapacity magazines that hold up to 500 rounds and there always loaded in the house.

But the young man wasn't done just yet. He giddily sent Abby this follow-up comment:

And I forgot to mention that i play violent video games daily, lol.

Perhaps we should be kind and give Shedenom's parents the benefit of the doubt, assuming they're not even present in the home. They're certainly making no positive difference in this young man's life even if they are.

The next comment we discovered featured a novel solution to problem of parenting kids around guns. Posting on a thread about "Guns and Kids" at PoliticalForum.com, pro-gun activist "Black Monarch" offered the following thought about what one should do with children who are too "stupid" to avoid shooting themselves with the guns you leave laying around:

Note: stupid kids may get ahold of guns and shoot each other or themselves. If your kids are stupid, give them up for adoption to protect your guns.

Everybody has their priorities, right?

Sometimes nothing helps with parenting like a loaded gun, however. That's what North Carolina dad Tommy Jordan showed the world when he posted the following video on Facebook to "discipline" his teenage daughter:



Oh, how to analyze this fabulous example of parenting? Allow us to quote a pastoral counselor who frequently posts at the CSGV Facebook page:

A "parent" who sees no problem with possession and use of a weapon is bad enough. A "parent" who sees use of his weapon as a "parenting tool" is a significant cause for concern. ANYONE who thinks that violence is a solution to ANY situation, is dangerous. Add to that, a child who's now been humiliated publicly for her behavior and has been taught by example by said parent, and who has access to WMD, and this points to a very dangerous mix. It may be too late for "intervention" for that family and closer to time for yet another family dissolution.

Despite the fact that the video earned him a visit from Child Protective Services, Jordan brags on his Facebook page, "If I had it to do again... let's see...I'd do it almost the same." What would he change? Well, he wishes he hadn't smoked a cigarette in the video, regrets using the word "ass" in reference to his daughter, and "maybe [I'd have] used the .22 instead of the .45," Jordan tells us. Talk about missing the target...

Finally, we present an even more inspiring example of pro-gun parenting. On February 9, The Today Show launched a new investigative series. Their first target was private firearm sales, so they ventured out into shopping mall parking lots in Phoenix, Arizona, to buy military-style assault rifles from individuals who are not legally obligated to either conduct background checks or keep any records of sale.

One of the private firearms sellers in The Today Show segment brought his 7-year-old son with him to sell an undercover investigator a tactical shotgun and an assault rifle straight out of the trunk of his car, no questions asked. "I probably couldn't pass [a background check]," the investigator told the man (meaning he could have been a felon, a wife beater, a sex offender, or mentally ill—just to name a few categories of prohibited purchasers). The man sold him the guns anyway and passed the cash directly to his son, adding, "I hate, I hate the government." He then ran away liked a coward when reporters attempted to question him on camera.

Perhaps it's now time to end this blog, because we simply no longer have the words...